HD For Indies

High Definition Video for Independent Filmmakers
A How To Guide for Digital Filmmakers
Welcome all! This is my blog to share my latest research,
thoughts, etc. on utilizing HD for independent filmmaking.

YES, I am available for consulting
Contact me at mike@hdforindies.com

All content copyright 2004-2007 Mike Curtis.

Friday, September 08, 2006

Amsterdam IBC 2006 Red News - New Red hardware

Red at IBC: New hardware details were announced at IBC today.

The Facts:
------------

New viewfinder - is 720p res viewfinder, is in line with the Red philosphy - can be bolted on anywhere on the camera. There will be some kind of focus assist that isn't being discussed yet, they are aware that a 4.5K image with a S35mm depth of field has a strong need for a strong focusing capability.

Red Rail System - the rail setup originally shown at NAB is getting more refined - all built to be able to finely adjust where stuff goes and how it balances for shoulder mount, and flexible in mounting options - put stuff on side, on top, flip it under/over, all kinds of options. Think Lego bricks kind of modularity, choices, and configurations.

Red Cage - substantially different from NAB, but largely the same from Cinegear. It is a cage for mounting the small camera on big stuff, or mounting stuff to the small camera. All those holes are for mounting anything anywhere. No more gaffers tape and velcro - have a REAL mounting point for all your accessories. Again, more Lego holes for mounting stuff - whatever, wherever.

LCD Panel - no details given, but it is built to be mounted anywhere, and is on a doubly articulated arm to swing around and angle how you want it. Solid design strategy there. They haven't said anything about it, but I'm guessing it'll be pretty high res, and have various clever capabilities in line with the rest of the Red strategy.

Recording and power - the hard drive unit and battery have been taken out of the camera body, and put together to go at the back of the Red Rail system, or bolted to top or bottom of the camera body itself. They are saying this is for better camera balance and flexible configurations - now they can make batteries and drive modules any size and not be limited to what the internal spaces would allow for. Hmm. More to say on this later.

Camera body itself - has been tweaked to be smaller and lighter. Much more detail is being shown about controls, buttons, screen locations, readouts, etc. on the models, but that isn't one of the talking points at the show. Study those renders - you can now recognize ports on the camera, and start getting a sense of how this sucker laces up when fully in use.

Red Zoom Lens - ah, the zoom! Vaguely discussed as basically "yes we're gonna" at NAB, now there are details - 18-85mm, f2.8, under $10,000. Shipping? In roughly a year, engineering target date, disclaimer disclaimer. But that is the next lens they are making.

Random detail - the handgrips on the RedRail system are from a late 1970s Oakley motorcycle handgrip design, one of Jim's early ones...just a fun detail he wanted to include.

Other than that, the specs are as stated at NAB - Super 35mm sized sensor, 1-60fps at up to 2540p res, windowed 2K performance (using Super 16 lenses) up to 120 fps, single/dual link HD-SDI & HDMI outputs, synced audio, etc.

-mike

Posted by: Mike Curtis / 9/08/2006 05:40:00 PM

Comments:

Mike:

Your blog used to be fascinating but now you seem to have become a mouthpiece for Red. I think you should change the title to RedforIndies.

You are a knowledgeable blogger with a huge audience of filmmakers, you are at IBC, you have a responsibility to your readers to let us know what is going on there.

I'll be much more interested in RED when they get within 6 months of an actual ship date or when they have a working prototype. For now, sorry, it's vaporware and there are some far more real breakthroughs out there that you should be writing about if you're going to stay true to the title of this blog. Such as the Andromeda modification to the DVX-100 or the Silicon Imaging camera.

Feels like I'm watching FOX news.

I will continue to frequent the site as a matter of habit but am now hunting around for a more balanced viewpoint.

# posted by

Jeffery : Sat Sep 09, 02:36:00 AM CST

Geez...lighten up Jeffrey. Seriously, Mike is finally showing us a ton of stuff about the Red camera after 6 months of waiting.I'm interested. As for Red (which is way out of my price range), this thing is a mass of accessories! 17.5K for the camera is one thing, but they ain't given away these cages, etc, etc. 10K for a zoom. Youch! I've got a Lomo zoom for a Konvas 35mm for $1800, with anamorphic rear attatchment. Boy do I feel good about that now! My zoom will only go up in price. Anyway, the cages seem a bit...um...excessive. This is starting to look like something cobbled together from Home Depot. I should know...I built a dual MS mic blimp from toilet flanges and screws...all from Home Depot. But with camera at 17.5K and zoom 10K, and accessory cages, another 1K I suppose...this thing is adding up. Still it is an amazing accomplishment for the price. I just wanna see what the sequel to the Panasonic HVX200 will be. No tape (thus smaller) and true 1080p would be all the camera I'd ever need!

# posted by

Anonymous : Sat Sep 09, 03:13:00 AM CST

As a DP, I think that the Red camera, if it all works, and ships, may prove to be one of the more exciting developments of our time.

It may prove to be a great story even if it doesn't work out, so I think that other than writing whatever he likes (since it's his blog), Mike should keep all this together in a file somewhere. He may just have all the info and have been the guy on the ground to write a great book about it one day.

I'm happy to keep reading it, and hey, if I change my mind I can just stop.

But I'm not going to go announcing it to everyone. I'd just come off like a bit of an arse then I reckon.

# posted by

Dale McCready : Sat Sep 09, 04:44:00 AM CST

I've been reading this blog since just about the start. And I sort of understand how you feel, Jeffery. Although I'm starting to feel like this might not be vaporware (it's finally gotten further than the Kinetta with actual footage), I still don't see the point in getting excited about something that will still change so much and is still so many months before even a prototype exists. What's the point in getting excited now?

I think the HVX200 is the most exciting thing to happen to HD this year, with it's great colors, slow-motion capabilities, and relatively light compression. I think the HDX-900 is a close second as far as exciting HD developments go. RED will be next year. I'll get excited next year. Maybe I'll let myself get excited when I see 2K or 4K footage projected for the first time, but not before.

Today I was much more interested in hearing about the update to Final Cut Pro (I've been waiting for native MXF support) than RED stuff, but it seems like everything else is an afterthought here now. To be honest, I'm also much more interested in hearing opinions on the Penelope and XTR Prod 2 and Arri 416 and the Xtera. From Aaton's website it looks like they've changed the XTR Prod 2's name to Xtera (which, it seems, was the old name for their HD film-style camera that was in development a few years ago). But I can't find any news or first hand reports anywhere on the net about any of these cameras because everyone's only talking about the RED. Yes, they're film, not HD. But they're certainly indie. For me, format doesn't matter. Just shoot on the best-looking, most practical medium that you can afford. Simple. But keep in mind, that might be film.

On another note, anyone hear what native resolution that new 25P Sony's sensor is? And it's a 1/4" sensor? That thing has HDMI output, right? Well, is that output before the signal hits the HDV compression? If so, how'd one of those cameras match up with with that new $249 "Intensity" HDMI capture card from Blackmagic? Maybe ask the folks at the Blackmagic booth how the quality of the HDMI compares to single-link HD-SDI? I'm guessing the HDMI output is a lot cheaper to add to a camera than a HD-SDI out.

-Rich

# posted by

Anonymous : Sat Sep 09, 04:47:00 AM CST

Mike spends his own precious time writing his blog and if he wants to write about Red then I welcome that writing. The minute Mike starts putting ads on his site then I have a right to complain but that's just my opinion. Mike is working the Red booth probably wearing his vocal cords bare talking to show-goers so I think we should cut him a little slack.

# posted by

Wes Vasher : Sat Sep 09, 06:32:00 AM CST

What - you have to use the cage on this thing!? One of the most important things for me is form factor, and having to lug around that monstrosity changes the whole ballgame. Won't there be some way to have this without the cage but still have a viewfinder and power? But Jeffrey - please - vaporware? They're showing footage, obviously have major financial backing and have kept people constantly in the loop. It's obviously no Kinetta. And I'm patting you on the back, Mike. It's time for some manners...

# posted by

Anonymous : Sat Sep 09, 11:24:00 AM CST

Hey all - yeah - I am WORKING in the Red booth, telling folks about it, wearing the Red hat (so to speak).

I didn't have time for breakfast since I was fixing the site (it was down for 5 or 6 hours I think), I had 10 minutes for lunch to grab a sandwich since it was busy, I haven't had a chance to walk the show floor, interview people for 30 minutes, because I am WORKING FOR SOMEONE ELSE at this show!

When things slow down and I feel it is responsible to duck out and see stuff I see if I can, but my first obligation is to the folks I am working for.

I did NOT go out and party with the group last night - I blogged for 4 or 5 hours.

I usually try to keep things polite on here, but I'm going to break my rule on this one, and try not to do it again.

So anyone that doesn't like it, fly yourself over on your own nickel and YOU interview, analyze, and write about it. Because that is YOUR responsibility.

Anyone that complains gets their money back.

Oh, you get all this for free? Then upon what basis do you feel it appropriate to complain in a public forum?

Jeffrey, reactions like yours takes ALL the fun out of doing this blog for me. I do this for free. Remember that. If it were a magazine you paid for, I think you might have some ground to stand on - "responsible blogger?" Please.

As for it's newsworthiness, you don't all the stuff going on here I can't blog about...I think it is worth covering.

-mike

# posted by

Mike Curtis : Sat Sep 09, 11:41:00 AM CST

Mike, now is a great time to simply say thank you. I read this blog a couple times a day and am continually amazed at the amount of work you put into it. I have learned so much from you and the information you share, and considering you're doing it all simply out of a passion for technology and filmmaking, I have one thing to say: Write about whatever you feel passionate about. IF right now that is the RED camera, then so be it. It IS your blog, after all. Thanks again.

# posted by

Anonymous : Sat Sep 09, 12:25:00 PM CST

Hi all and have a look on video IBC2006 - Red Digital 4K Presentation at

http://www.youtube.com/player2.swf?video_id=0ymt4QGoapA&l=232&t=OEgsToPDskJHKJgRCQwIhSYwV3do0xPe&nc=39168

# posted by

Anonymous : Sat Sep 09, 02:14:00 PM CST

Jeffrey,
That was an inappropriate comment. Bloggers owe their audience (assuming they even have an audience beyond their friends and family) nothing. If you paid money for access to the wealth of info on this site then you might have a leg to stand on but since you get all this info for free you really have no right to dictate to Mike what he should write in his own blog.

Mike,
Can you give approximate dimensions of the RED body and the RED rail system?

Thanks.

# posted by

Andrew K. : Sat Sep 09, 02:19:00 PM CST

Again, as iterated above..."Thanks Mike"

You write whatever the hell you want to write, and I"ll read it if I want to, but not ever complain. You put so much time in to this and it's such a resource that I suppose it could be considered flattering that people think you are their personal information stop. Except of course for the rude way in which people like Jeffrey gripe on.

You save the rest of us from a fair bit of scrounging, and as to reading about the 416 and so on, it's funny that people give you a list of things to write about, yet there's nothing stopping them going out there and writing their own blog about their personal pet interest.

But it's easier to nag you I guess, rather than saying a big thank you for all the time you put into this blog, which is the page my browsers open onto incidentally.

# posted by

Dale McCready : Sat Sep 09, 04:34:00 PM CST

I'll also send you a hearty thank you for all your hard work Mike. Write about jelley and I'll still read.

# posted by

Wes Vasher : Sat Sep 09, 04:49:00 PM CST

On topic comment about viewfinder:

If you have a 1280x720 LCD viewfinder, is there anything stopping them from doing the subpixel thing? Something similar to what consumer camcorders, digital still cameras, etc do now. Or like what Windows and OS X do to make fonts crisper on LCDs.

Eg if you address each R, G, B element separately, you will get effectively 3840x720 luma resolution with color resolution at 1280x720.

This doesn't necessarily apply just to the Red. Maybe the Silicon Imaging people do it already.

Anyway, with the Red, you don't really NEED a 4.5k viewfinder. That would be 3x overkill on the colour space.

Of course, they are a bit sneaky about this on their site - they seem to try to imply that their camera is 11.4M pixels versus Sony's 2.1M pixels, when actually it is a SINGLE 11.4Mpixel sensor versus THREE 2.1Mpixel sensors... okay, I'm going off topic, now, sorry.

Bruce Allen

# posted by

Bruce Allen : Sat Sep 09, 05:31:00 PM CST

thanks for the support, guys, sorry I was so cranky earlier. It has been a loooooong couple of days working.

-mike

# posted by

Mike Curtis : Sat Sep 09, 06:09:00 PM CST

I think that rail system is a smart idea. The biggest problem with most cameras, from Arris, Panvisions and also Sonys, is the handheld operating once you start putting any sort of decent lenses and accessories on them.

I'd pick a balanced heavy camera over a lighter one that I have to hold out in front any day and I've often picked a 1000ft mag over a 400ft one for that very reason. Being able to adjust the fore/aft position is critical.

They should also ideally give you the option of an angle tweak, Sony used to make nice angled shoulder pads up till about 6 or 7 years ago, then went flat (the new 900 R is better though) and it's been a hassle finding a natural horizon with them.

I can't tell from the picture but hopefully you'll be able to configure things to get the battery and drive on top when shooting in tight corners, which is somehting the pana XL and Arricams do nicely with the top loading mag. Better a wide camera than a long one.

Can't wait to take all the cage stuff off and put the camera on the dashboard of a car and shoot!

# posted by

Dale McCready : Sat Sep 09, 08:32:00 PM CST

Mike. Stop it! Tired of you talking about RED!!!! Until it ships it doesn't exist.

# posted by

Anonymous : Sun Sep 10, 12:39:00 AM CST

Anonymous - it's this or hearing what I had for breakfast man! Like I said, I'm working in their booth, so that's all I see all day...

-mike

# posted by

Mike Curtis : Sun Sep 10, 12:45:00 AM CST

You know to 'create' is to invite comments and those are often based on the assumption that you 'owe them something', clearly you don't. Your doing a great job and really you have to know that loads of people appreciate all your work, and effort.
As someone who has worked on a public web site for years and years (fxguide.com) I know how disheartening it can be to get flippant comments, but as a Red customer (#22) I am begging you man- please don't stop ! :-)

Mike Seymour

# posted by

Mike Seymour : Sun Sep 10, 09:53:00 PM CST

Ok, sorry Mike, I was feeling frustrated and vented earlier.

I guess I'm just sad to see Mike got hired out and has now pretty much become a mouthpiece for RED. It does look like it may one day be a great camera but I used to greatly value his unattached viewpoint.

Of course, he has a right to write anything he wants on his blog.

Maybe I'm a little cynical but I think it was a great move on RED's behalf to hire one of the leading bloggers to work for them. I can completely understand Mike's saying YES to that as he needs to eat like the rest of us plus I know he's excited (like many of us) about this technology.

I just feel like I've lost another great information source to corporate interests.

Welcome to the 21st century. Corporations have caught on to the power of bloggers.

Kudos to you Mike for your wealth of knowledge and experience. And thanks for pointing out clearly your conflict of interest. I'm sure many bloggers don't.

# posted by

Jeffery : Mon Sep 11, 11:45:00 AM CST

Jeffrey - I need to clarify what appears to be a misunderstanding:

Red has asked me to work their booth during the day - what I blog in the wee hours on my own spare time is up to me. Red doesn't have editorial or any other control over what I write. If I wanted to say it was a piece of crap, I would.

As I said before, I'm working all day every day in the booth - I managed to slip out for a bit and got a demo of SCRATCH, which is definitely killer and I'll transcribe my audio notes and post about it when I have time...which isn't going to be in the next few days - a client wants to fly me to a nearby European country for a consulting gig, so it looks like that's what I'm up to after the show ends.

Wait, drifting off track - the point being, I don't have time during the day most days to see anything. So as I said earlier, the only HD For Indies relevant information I acquire daily is stuff about Red - otherwise you folks get to hear about me oversleeping, being hung over, racing to the convention center, then hooking up with Martijn Schroevers (longtime reader) for a great evening outdoors in Amsterdam for beers and dinner. OK, actually that last part is kinda fun and interesting, but you know what I mean.

There is a definite and clear boundary between agreeing to work in a booth for someone, and covering it as that is all that is seen, and being hired specifically and directly to write favorably about a product.

-mike

# posted by

Mike Curtis : Mon Sep 11, 03:17:00 PM CST

Keep it coming Mike. The other press-releasy stuff will be covered in the other video blogs, you're giving us something unique.

# posted by

Jaymis : Mon Sep 11, 09:16:00 PM CST

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Friday, September 08, 2006

Amsterdam IBC 2006 Red News - New Red hardware